Quote:

I agree and it should be over long time ago - and was MorphOS 1.x picked to be start base
instead porting plain OS3 we would be lightyears away. But thats Amiga Inc Hype choice.

I have edited my post on your request.

And decided not to buy your work ever, due to defending what is undefendable and nitpicking
to blame me as criminal, not real fraudsters, you in a way support.

Its not war - its ethical reasoning who profits and what he did so far.|
Biggest mistake is OS4 is in Hype hands.

@vox:

i appreciate that you edited your post. This issue is settled for me to never be worded again.

Quote:

Thanks. I am a decent person, believe it, or not.
On Blue vs OS4 wars: OS4 killed itself due to being in wrong hands.
Porting old games and having OS3 versions is nice deed, I salute you for enhancements,
but will not save the day. Beside better Warp3D Nova (weak OpenGL kind of) implementation,
and drivers thanks to Hans, there is very little OS4 can offer that MOS cant do.
I supported it when it looked promising (OS 4.2, Libre, TW) but lets call it a day.
AROS and MOS have much better perspective and better compatibility/hardware availiability.
iMac G5 for 50e and 100e MOS license give more power and joy then 2000eur x1000, and most important
work out of box with no additional money milking.
Thus I advise you to reconsider coding for MOS and AROS.

Again - Licensing for MOS or AROS would then raise the cost for a licence.

Currently biggest Amiga market for games (even in the various small sub-markets) is AmigaOS 3.x 68k. So if doing anything which makes sense it would need to be a licence for AmigaOS. Adding in MorphOS and AROS would triple the licence price. You won't get a licence for "something which is mostly source-code compatible to AmigaOS".

And at least as to MOS you can get it supported with a WarpOS version which still would be a "AmigaOS 3.x version" so covered by a licence for AmigaOS.

I think both OS4 and MOS don't have much more option than the other (MOS the better Browser and thanks to Mac machines better availability, OS4 the better 3D Solution) but in the end it is a personal decision which you like more.

Both markets - at least as to commercial game porting - cannot pay a licence on their own (68k MIGHT but not sure, it is better that with OS4 and WarpOS versions you can get the game to WarpOS machines, OS4 machines and MOS machines as well, OS4/WOS versions basically "riding" on top of 68k - I was not aware of this till recently myselves - I always thought OS4 would be the biggest ^^).

Licencing for MOS-only is not financially viable (at least not anymore, probably was in the past) and also it would mean me developing for a system which I do not even own (my fav "Amiga-kind" is OS4, but as you will have seen recently I also support other platforms which can be covered with "AmigaOS licence").

My current plan is still for future games to support 68k/OS4/WOS in parallel. And I have some Betatesters who have MOS too, so they can test the WOS-Versions on MOS (one of them several different MOS-systems).

If you want to continue to discuss this I suggest not in this thread but open a separate thread on this forum.

Moved to new thread at Magics suggestion
https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=13900&post_id=160471&order=0&viewmode=flat&pid=0&forum=3#160471

[ Edited by vox 07.12.2024 - 17:51 ]

Quote:

Thanks, bought the game and now waiting to be shipped :)

FYI, on window mode the fmvs are still played on fullscreen so I think need a different mplayer variable has to be too for proper window mode as well? But most of all, while ingame (from options screen and onwards) I get flashing screen, cpu reaches 100% and game crawls, so it's unplayable at least for me. Well, not that it's a big issue since window cannot be resized from what I saw briefly but have a look at it in the future if other MorphOS users confirm it.

Also, a feature request, would be it possible to support mousewheel while scrolling the inventory?

Prices reduced. If I get it right one needs to have data files for all except Gorky.

I would prefer to see Q1 as I love Lovecraftian Quake, but that just me.
Gorky 17 sadly does not have competition on Amiga, except OpenXcom and TFD
Heretic 2 is nice but I prefer Hexen 2.

However this is indeed good, price reducing.

MSN on AW.net (should be news here too with buy links)

Hi!

On 6th December finally Gorky 17 for WarpOS will be released.

The WarpOS Binaries will be available for free for buyers of the 68k Version of Gorky17.
Starting 6th December if you buy the 68k Version the WOS version will also be included
as a Installation Option.

Minimum Specs are 240 MHz PowerPC (300 MHz recommended) and 192 MB RAM.
The game has been tested on "old" PowerPC Cards (BPPC+CPPC), PCI PowerPC Cards (SonnetPPC and ApocalypsePPC) and also on some Mac-Hardware (Mac-Hardware with MorphOS).

Additionally to the release of Gorky17 for WarpOS between 6th December 2024 and 8th December 2024 the Games Heretic 2 and Quake 2 will be available at a reduced price on the Alinea Online Shop.

The reduced price will be:

Heretic II - 39,95 EUR (includes 68k and OS4 version)
Quake 2 - 11,95 EUR

Steffen Häuser

> If I get it right one needs to have data files for all except Gorky.

Heretic II also has the data files included, just like the year 2000 release.

> I would prefer to see Q1

Aren't there enough port of this already?

> Gorky 17 sadly does not have competition on Amiga, except OpenXcom and TFD

TFD?

[quote]Andreas_Wolf wrote:
> I would prefer to see Q1
Aren't there enough port of this already?
[/quote]

I am not aware of Amiga one that is MorphOS plus
that supports 2 official expansions pack and 2 newer ones that came
with remaster. That is now full rounded Quake 1 :D

Quake also comes with both original expansion packs: “The Scourge of Armagon” and “Dissolution of Eternity,” as well as two expansions developed by the award-winning team at MachineGames: “Dimension of the Past,” and the all-new “Dimension of the Machine.”

> Gorky 17 sadly does not have competition on Amiga, except OpenXcom and TFD

TFD?[/quote]

Terror from the deep aka real Xcom2, underwater. Harder, more interesting.
They have also been reworked, bugfixed etc. making OpenXCom great asset
https://openxcom.org/forum/index.php/topic,4265.0.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-COM:_Terror_from_the_Deep

Now Xcom Apocalypse needs a bit of love
https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/OpenApoc
And maybe some Laser Squad revamp, Sabre Team maybe too
and modern revamps look childish :D

Thanks to Powel, OpenXcom port that includes TFD support is quite updated
https://www.morphos-storage.net/?id=2227354

I would donate towards OpenApoc port.

While I do understand that reworked ports come from earlier Amiga licenses,
its simply the games ported that I dont find attractive enough, as each has better alternative,
and as presented, some are free, aparat from data files.

Also, Hexen 2 exists for MOS, its on Quake engine!!!
https://uhexen2.sourceforge.net/download.html#morphos_ppc




[ Edited by vox 09.12.2024 - 11:33 ]

>>> Gorky 17 sadly does not have competition on Amiga,
>>> except OpenXcom and TFD

>> TFD?

> Terror from the deep aka real Xcom2

Ah yes, I know that. TFTD would have rang a bell with me, or maybe if you wrote "OpenXcom with TFD" :-)

> Thanks to Powel, OpenXcom port that includes TFD support is quite updated
> https://www.morphos-storage.net/?id=2227354

These recent updates are by Bruno 'BeWorld' Peloille, not Pawel.

> Hexen 2 exists for MOS, its on Quake engine!!!

Yes, enhanced one.

Even I do find other good games competitive and free if you have data files,
I do respect work of every developer for AMigaOS and alike, even we disagree on AmigaOS4 past, present and future and relationship to customers who invested thousand euros,

So here is good news on price discount from AW.net, posted by our dear Steffen
!

On 6th December finally Gorky 17 for WarpOS will be released.

The WarpOS Binaries will be available for free for buyers of the 68k Version of Gorky17.
Starting 6th December if you buy the 68k Version the WOS version will also be included
as a Installation Option.

Minimum Specs are 240 MHz PowerPC (300 MHz recommended) and 192 MB RAM.
The game has been tested on "old" PowerPC Cards (BPPC+CPPC), PCI PowerPC Cards (SonnetPPC and ApocalypsePPC) and also on some Mac-Hardware (Mac-Hardware with MorphOS).

Additionally to the release of Gorky17 for WarpOS between 6th December 2024 and 8th December 2024 the Games Heretic 2 and Quake 2 will be available at a reduced price on the Alinea Online Shop.

The reduced price will be:

Heretic II - 39,95 EUR (includes 68k and OS4 version)
Quake 2 - 11,95 EUR

Steffen Häuser

Price reduced H2/Q2:

https://www.amiga-shop.net/specials.php

Demo Gorky 17 download
https://t.me/morphosisbest/225
or
https://www.hyperion-entertainment.com/index.php/downloads?view=files&parent=38

> here is good news on price discount from AW.net,
> posted by our dear Steffen [...]

Isn't this still the same as you posted in comment #57?

Ok,

I bought the from Alinea for MorphOs but I'm not able to install it.
CD-Rom seems to be totally useless for MorphOs, so I tried install it from USB Disk.

With the Mos Installer the installation fails and gives lha errors while extracting.
After that I tried with Installer NG from Aminet.
Same errors.
Then I copied everything to my Linux machine and copied it with scp.
Same errors. MD5sums of the lha archives match (same on usb, linux and mos).

I don't know what to do?!?!?!?!?
Registration on Hyperion Site is only for Gorky 17 (Amiga OS4).

Sorry, but don't know what you tested there but this totally broken currently.

EDIT:
From Download section on Hyperion site you can get different archives:
Gorky17Drawer.lha
Gorky17_v1.1.ha

both should be for Amiga Os. Which Amiga Os???? 3? 4? I don't know.
Gorky17 executables are not named with the architecture (or system names), I don't know which one I should use.
There are executables called "Gorky17", "Gorky 17" (with and without space).

Maybe someone managed to install this stuff on a MorphOs machine.
But I don't know how. From CD? From Usb? Maybe with an archive from Hyperion Site?
Which one? Which Installer? What should be replaced after a potential successful installation?

@Eliot:

I tried on several different systems (non-MorphOS) and two people tried on MorphOS systems (several Apple-Hardware-based MorphOS-Systems) and nobody had any issues with dearchiving the lha files (the lha files are depacked during installation).

I assume a faulty USB Stick. Or maybe the (68k-)lha executable has problems with very large files on certain versions of MorphOS (cannot be a general issue as other people could install it fine).

I can alternatively offer to send you an "installed version" as a lha-archive (if that does not work either then definitely lha has an issue with some version of MorphOS ? But I somehow doubt this to be the issue, someone would have noticed this by now), if you provide me evidence of purchase (copy of the invoice for buying the game).

You can email that to tirionareonwe@gmail.com.

Best regards,
Steffen

Quote:

Thanks for the information. I do not think (if I remember right) there is a WarpOS native Warp3D, I think it was only 68k back then.

MiniGL 68k (which would be used in case of a WarpOS program with 3D) would then translate to the MorphOS-native 3D Application if I got this right ? In this case 3D Stuff should work.

I currently do these things on 3D-Games:

OS 4 - GL4ES Version (best option for x1000/x5000 as it does not require to buy Novabridge and you can expect owners of x1000/x5000 to have RadeonHD/RadeonRX cards installed)
OS4 - MiniGL Version (for users of stuff like old PPC Hardware which do not support RadeonHD/RadeonRX - this version will NOT run on modern PPC systems though as those require GL4ES), it is pretty easy for me to do both versions though.
68k - usually no MiniGL Version, as no 3D HW in the typical target systems (PiStorm/Vampire) yet. I did compile a MiniGL Renderer (which would use Warp3D 68k) for Heretic 2 though)
WOS - MiniGL which means Warp3D 68k (not in case of G17 which used MiniGL V2 which is only available for OS4). Future WOS Games will probably use MiniGL V1 so a 3D HW Version would be possible for WOS and MOS systems.

MagicSN

Quote:

Is it possible you can make a video of the flashing. Is it only in fullscreen, only in Window mode or both ?

If it is Window mode it might be an issue with WarpOS stuff. On another game I work on I noticed Window Mode is extremely slow on Window Mode (to the point where I disabled window mode for that game).

From my MorphOS testers I did not hear anything on the game crawling, can you tell me what version of MorphOS and what hardware you have (so I can compare with what my testers with MorphOS systems use) ?

Thanks.

MagicSN

Installation from Hdd did work, thanks!

Code:

But Gorgy17 does not work after installation.
It starts, open a screen, everything is black, after a few seconds I am back on Ambient screen.

Crash log:
Code:

I checked MPlayer with installed avis, this works fine.


Settings.ini:
Code:

[ Edited by eliot 12.12.2024 - 17:36 ]

>> What does run on MorphOS for sure (until the TinyRave release only on
>> Radeon R100/R200, though) are Warp3D+WarpOS programs. I suspect that
>> running MiniGL programs requires m68k MiniGL (or WarpOS one, if there is)
>> to be installed to translate the MiniGL API calls to Warp3D API calls, which
>> are then processed by MorphOS' own Warp3D implementation (Goa3D).

> MiniGL 68k [...] would then translate to the MorphOS-native
> 3D Application if I got this right ?

I never tried it, but I think MiniGL would translate to Goa3D, which btw is *not* MorphOS' proper 3D subsystem. That would be TinyGL. Goa3D is just there for Warp3D compatibility.

> In this case 3D Stuff should work.

Goa3D only works on Voodoo and Radeon R100/R200 series GPUs (but TinyRave has been announced to remedy that). There's also 3rd party Wazp3D which comes with a TinyGL hardware renderer that also works on the newer Radeon GPUs supported by TinyGL. I have no first-hand experience regarding Wazp3D's completeness, accuracy and performance if used in this way, though.

@Andreas Wolf:

Danke erneut für die Erläuterungen.

Ich werde auf jeden Fall MiniGL-Versionen von 3D-Spielen (ein Kandidat ist "Sin") zur Verfügung stellen, solange dies technisch möglich ist (von Sin habe ich bereits einen MiniGL-Renderer, der funktioniert, wobei ich das Spiel noch in der aktuellen Version auf WOS anpassen muss). Irgendwann in der Zukunft kann es sein, dass MiniGL zum "Auslaufsmodell" wird. PC-Spiele gehen immer mehr auf die Shader-Schiene, und für AmigaOS bedeutet das GL4ES. Das ist unter OS4 verfügbar (und sollte PiStorm je eine 3DHW Unterstützung bekommen, so wird das vermutlich auch GL4ES werden - auf Linux-Seite des Raspberry Pi ist das schon die verwendete API).

Momentan ist das auch wegen der kleinen Zahl unterstützter Systeme (nur "neue OS4 Systeme" sprich x1000m x5000 oder Sam mit geeigneter Grafikkarte) uninteressant für Spiele-Lizenzen (zu kleiner Markt nur OS4 mit neuen Geräten allein - gibt ne Menge OS4 User die noch ein altes Gerät haben oder keine Southern Island Chipset oder andere unterstützte Karte), aber sollte GL4ES auf PiStorm ebenfalls kommen könnte sich das ändern (ich erwarte das aber nicht in näherer Zukunft), dass auch Spiele mit Shadern interessant werden.

TinyRave basiert auf der RaveAPI also wie "altes Warp3D" und MiniGL eine "alte" 3D API. Also etwas was für Backward Compatibility mit alter Hardware gedacht ist. Neuere Spiele, da gibt es im Prinzip nur entweder Vulkan (auf AmigaOS nicht wirklich eine Option, die "aufwendige" Option wäre Portierung auf GLES bzw. Warp3DNova (Warp3DNova hat im Prinzip mit Warp3D im Prinzip den Namen gemein, sonst nicht viel, orientiert sich an GLES), eine Portierung auf etwas wie TinyRave/TinyGL - nicht möglich, nicht mal mit viel Aufwand) oder eben Spiele mit Support für GL4ES (wobei die eher aus dem Mobile Markt kommen, unter Windows kommt mehr und mehr Vulkan zum Einsatz - leider).

Wie gesagt alles momentan irrelevant, aber in den nächsten 5 Jahren (falls es da noch Amiga-Betriebssysteme bzw. Spieleports dafür) gibt kommen. Momentan suche ich eh eher nach Titeln die auch ohne 3D HW laufen (wegen den 68k Geräten, um die Anzahl der potentiellen Käufer zu vergrößern).

Wazp3D - Heretic2 läuft darauf etwa, aber recht lahm. Auch sieht es "nicht so gut aus" wie unter Warp3D (Unterschiede in der Implementierung, fehlende Features, vermute ich). Ich weiß aber, dass Alain Thellier derzeit sehr stark daran arbeitet (auch mit Hinblick einer HW-Unterstützung des Apollo Vampire). Wazp3D würde übrigens nicht das prinzipielle Problem lösen, das kann auch keine Shader. Habe Wazp3D bisher nur auf PiStorm und Vampire ausprobiert, nicht unter PPC (da man unter PPC Warp3D hat).

MagicSN

Wa

> Danke erneut für die Erläuterungen.

You're welcome. Please understand that I reply in English language nontheless as I believe non-English discussion to be against the forum rules outside the International Forums.

> Momentan ist das auch wegen der kleinen Zahl unterstützter Systeme
> (nur "neue OS4 Systeme" [...]) uninteressant für Spiele-Lizenzen
> (zu kleiner Markt nur OS4 mit neuen Geräten allein - gibt ne Menge
> OS4 User die noch ein altes Gerät haben [...])

GCN1/GCN4-based cards can also be made to work in old non-PCIe OS4 systems with a PCI-2-PCIe-bridge (Pegasos II (#193), Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOne XE), but I can understand your point.

> TinyRave basiert auf der RaveAPI also wie
> "altes Warp3D" und MiniGL eine "alte" 3D API.

This depends on what you mean with "basiert" :-) Basically, TinyRave is supposed to make old Warp3D programs run on Radeon R300 and newer GPUs by translating Goa3D's Rave3D output to TinyGL.

> Also etwas was für Backward Compatibility mit alter Hardware gedacht ist.

No, it's for backward compatibility with old *software* on *newer* graphics hardware.

> Neuere Spiele, da gibt es im Prinzip nur entweder Vulkan ([...]
> eine Portierung auf [...] TinyRave/TinyGL - nicht möglich [...])

Porting to TinyRave indeed wouldn't make any sense, as that would mean porting to ancient Rave3D. Porting to TinyGL however may be possible somewhen in the future.

> oder eben Spiele mit Support für GL4ES

As far as I understand, games do not support GL4ES. They either support OpenGL or OpenGL ES (GLES). GL4ES allows to run OpenGL games on OpenGL ES.

> Wazp3D - Heretic2 läuft darauf etwa, aber recht lahm. Auch
> sieht es "nicht so gut aus" wie unter Warp3D (Unterschiede
> in der Implementierung, fehlende Features, vermute ich).

This sounds like using Wazp3D's software rendering. As I wrote, Wazp3D can use TinyGL as hardware renderer on MorphOS. Some links:

Comment on beta 56 (#65) - with new TinyGL hardware renderer
Comment on newer beta (#13) - with Youtube link showing Heretic II on Wazp3D using TinyGL hardware renderer
Comment on fullscreen support (#53) - with notion that beta 56 TinyGL hardware renderer only supports window mode (fullscreen mode supported as of beta 56.2)

Hi!

Sorry for the German. I had replied a post on os4welt.de before (which is a German forum) and somehow my mind had stuck in German

>This depends on what you mean with "basiert" Basically, TinyRave is supposed to make old Warp3D >programs run on Radeon R300 and newer GPUs by translating Goa3D's Rave3D output to TinyGL.

My point was if I understand it right 3D APIs on MorphOS are base on old non-shader-based APIs. These still work right now, but they will become irrelevant in the future.

It is even worse for WarpOS Apps - unless someone updates the 68k implementations WarpOS Apps are also stuck in non-shader-based APIs for 3DHW.

It is not a problem NOW. And probably won't for some time. But if I should give recommendation to the makers of MorphOS it would be to add shader-based APIs and even do some 68k drivers for them (to enable WarpOS programs to use them). Not sure if this is feasible.

>Porting to TinyRave indeed wouldn't make any sense, as that would mean porting to ancient Rave3D. Porting >to TinyGL however may be possible somewhen in the future

As I said before MorphOS native APIs are not an option for commercial game ports. What you can get to run on MorphOS are WarpOS apps. And they as to 3D APIs stick to non-shader-based APIs.

Just for the sake of discussion does TinyGL offer support for Shaders ? If yes what Shader language does it use ?

It actually is closer than I thought when I wrote my German post - the first commercial Amiga game which requires Shaders came out this week (not by me), Super Star Blast by Entwickler-X (this is because it is a port of other platforms where Shaders is the standard), for OS4.

Note for myselves it would not be an option right now. I want the 68k sales too which requires a software renderer, so I definitely would NOT require a shader API right now.

>As far as I understand, games do not support GL4ES. They either support OpenGL or OpenGL ES (GLES). >GL4ES allows to run OpenGL games on OpenGL ES.

You are correct. I meant GLES.

>This sounds like using Wazp3D's software rendering. As I wrote, Wazp3D can use TinyGL as hardware >renderer on MorphOS.

Again the question is what can TinyGL do ? For now it is definitely enough. Probably also the next years. But depending on the features - what if a game uses GLES ? What about WarpOS games ?

MagicSN

> if I understand it right 3D APIs on MorphOS
> are base on old non-shader-based APIs.

Yes, for now. The link I gave you to the news article "Bounty for improved OpenGL support and new graphics card drivers" in turn links to the project website where can be read regarding TinyGL's planned shader support:

"I suggest working more towards getting the most common functionality working correctly, and then adding extra functionality later if it turns out it's needed for an interesting application or game. Note that MorphOS already has some (quite partial) support for OpenGL shaders on R300 and R400 only. This would need to be extended to fully implement the OpenGL API, to support more of the OpenGL Shading Language and handle more complex shaders, and finally also to support R200 and R500 hardware."

...and from the ReadMe of the current TinyGL public beta:

"The "Shader Test" example demonstrates the use of OpenGL vertex and fragment shaders to create effects that would not possible with the fixed function OpenGL pipeline. This example uses a vertex shader to animate the rendered object and a fragment shader to create custom lighting effects as well as conditional discarding of output fragments, creating the illusion that the rendered model is more detailed than it actually is.
"ShaderBoy" is an application that allows you to test and play around with shaders. It has several different presets and allows you to edit vertex and fragment shaders, with a live display of the result of those shaders. It also allows you to edit various OpenGL states including textures and lighting."

> if I should give recommendation to the makers of MorphOS
> it would be to add shader-based APIs

Seems they heard you before you told them so ;-)

> and even do some 68k drivers for them
> (to enable WarpOS programs to use them).

Wouldn't WarpOS programs on MorphOS be able to use PPC-native drivers?

>> Porting to TinyGL however may be possible somewhen in the future

> MorphOS native APIs are not an option for commercial game ports.

That's why I wrote "in the future". "Are" is present tense.

> does TinyGL offer support for Shaders ?

To answer this question was the purpose of said link in my previous comment.

> If yes what Shader language does it use ?

In the beta archive I see mention of GLSL v1.20. Also there were some comments on this by the authors 2 years ago:

https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=49&topic_id=13285&start=158 (#159, #165)

Better than GLSL v1.20 is unfortunately not possible with Radeon R500's OpenGL v2.1. R600/R700's OpenGL v3.3 would make GLSL v3.30 possible, and R800/R900's OpenGL v4.5 would make GLSL v4.50 possible.

>>> Wazp3D - Heretic2 läuft darauf etwa, aber recht lahm. Auch
>>> sieht es "nicht so gut aus" wie unter Warp3D (Unterschiede
>>> in der Implementierung, fehlende Features, vermute ich).

>> This sounds like using Wazp3D's software rendering. As I wrote,
>> Wazp3D can use TinyGL as hardware renderer on MorphOS.

> Again the question is what can TinyGL do ?

It can -- currently via Wazp3D's TinyGL hardware renderer (and maybe somewhen also via TinyRave) -- run Warp3D games like Heretic II on Radeon R300 or newer. Have you watched the video of it? Does it look "lahm" or "nicht so gut" to you?

> what if a game uses GLES ?

It won't run as long as MorphOS doesn't have a GLES implementation.

> What about WarpOS games ?

They do already run, don't they?

Hi, Andreas!

Sounds quite decent actually. I was mislead by the earlier talk of "Rave".

>Wouldn't WarpOS programs on MorphOS be able to use PPC-native drivers?

But the problem: WarpOS only supports MiniGL, there is no API available to WarpOS to access shaders (of course if someone did such an API for WarpOS this would be a fix of the problem). I would not do native MorphOS versions in ported commercial games, remember my licences do (and will in the future) only be for AmigaOS licence.


>It can -- currently via Wazp3D's TinyGL hardware renderer (and maybe somewhen also via TinyRave) -- run >Warp3D games like Heretic II on Radeon R300 or newer. Have you watched the video of it? Does it look >"lahm" or "nicht so gut" to you?

I never said it did. I was referring to Wazp3D, not Warp3D Apps under MorphOS. They run fine!

>> What about WarpOS games ?

>They do already run, don't they?

I was referring to something using GLES. Admitted right now this is not a problem. Also for immediate future not a problem. But in further future (I mentioned "next 5 years" it might. I think we misunderstood each other in the last two posts.

MagicSN

> I was mislead by the earlier talk of "Rave".

Rave3D was mentioned by me in no other context than planned TinyRave, i.e. running Warp3D software on MorphOS with Radeon R300 GPUs and newer in hardware rendering (see comments #47, #68, #70).

>>> and even do some 68k drivers for them
>>> (to enable WarpOS programs to use them).

>> Wouldn't WarpOS programs on MorphOS be able to use PPC-native drivers?

> I would not do native MorphOS versions in ported commercial games,
> remember my licences do (and will in the future) only be for AmigaOS licence.

I was admittedly neglecting this point with my question and only looked at the technical side. So yes, an m68k-accessible shader API by the MorphOS Team would make sense for your potential future ports of shader-requiring games, where you support WarpOS/m68k platforms and your port then also "happens to run on MorphOS by chance". However, the chances of this happening are slim to none, I think.

>>>>>> There's also 3rd party Wazp3D which comes with a TinyGL hardware
>>>>>> renderer that also works on the newer Radeon GPUs supported by TinyGL.

>>>>> Wazp3D - Heretic2 läuft darauf etwa, aber recht lahm. Auch
>>>>> sieht es "nicht so gut aus" wie unter Warp3D (Unterschiede
>>>>> in der Implementierung, fehlende Features, vermute ich).

>>>> This sounds like using Wazp3D's software rendering. As I wrote,
>>>> Wazp3D can use TinyGL as hardware renderer on MorphOS.

>>> Again the question is what can TinyGL do ?

>> It can -- currently via Wazp3D's TinyGL hardware renderer
>> (and maybe somewhen also via TinyRave) -- run Warp3D games
>> like Heretic II on Radeon R300 or newer. Have you watched the
>> video of it? Does it look "lahm" or "nicht so gut" to you?

> I never said it did.

But you did, see above. I was the first one in this thread to mention Wazp3D (comment #68), and I specifically did so in no other context than running Warp3D software on MorphOS with Radeon R300 GPUs and newer in TinyGL hardware rendering. In comment #69 you then referred to Wazp3D using the quoted wording. To me this seems like you just reacted to the word "Wazp3D", not taking the MorphOS-specific context into account.

> I was referring to Wazp3D, not Warp3D Apps under MorphOS.

But Warp3D apps under MorphOS on Radeon R300 GPUs and newer can be run in hardware rendering *using Wazp3D*, including Heretic II. You try to make that two distinct topics, but on MorphOS they are not. That's what I've been trying to tell you since my comment #68, apparently unsuccessfully.

>>> What about WarpOS games ?

>> They do already run, don't they?

> I was referring to something using GLES.

This would require a GLES implementation accessible from WarpOS first, which I don't see coming. If there'll be such thing, my statement regarding GLES games on MorphOS in general applies.

> I think we misunderstood each other in the last two posts.

Yes, on several levels ;-)

Quote:

Has this been resolved so far? Just received my copy from Alinea. USB stick was dropping dead on my Mac but copying the content from Sam440ep/OS4 to MorphOS enabled me to proceed with installation. However, afterwards I am on the same page with you (brief black screen and back on Ambient).